# Optical Forums > Ophthalmic Optics >  New ABO Master Exam

## Darryl Meister

I was just wondering how many OptiBoarders have taken the ABO's new Advanced Certification exam that replaced the old Master Optician exam? Any comments on the content and level of the questions?

Best regards,
Darryl

----------


## Bev Heishman

I took the new exam as well as several other Master's a few years ago at the request of the ABO.  I felt the original one I took was a little more difficult than the new.

----------


## Laurie

I took the original master exam as well.  Then, during an ABOM item writing workshop I worked with a small team reviewing the ABO-AC (i.e. "new master exam").  We found it to be less focused on ophthalmic optics, with added business/refractometry material that did not seem to fit in.

I am a supporter of the abo master program and do not mean to sound negative.  We should, however, bring back the original exam.

: )

my 0.02 worth...

Laurie

----------


## LaurieC

It's been so many years since I took any of them that I think there's been quite a few changes. So this points out to me that before I am working on any client's project that may include recommendations on certification I need to get up to speed. I wonder if I should retake the exams just to see if I'd be considered all that competent now??? That or have my good twin, Laurie help refresh me. I don't think I believe in a lot of business questions in the advanced exam, other than perhaps business ethics. I think they are two different areas that don't necessarily need mingled.

----------


## William Walker

I took the ABOA exam in April, and I studied materials given to me by other master opticians.  I focused on the math, and think I did very well on that part of the exam.  However, there were questions on the exam that I had no idea about.

One such example went along the lines of:
'To be a manager, one must officially supervise:
A: 1 full time employee
B: 2 full time employees
C: 1 full time and 1 part time employee
D:2 part time employees

What the heck is that?

There were a lot of other questions that I thought were very random, and hard to actually study for, so I'm not expecting to have passed it, but hopefully I'll know enough to pass it the next time around.

----------


## Lee Prewitt

I did not take the "old" test but the current one is a very comprehensive look at opticianry as a total.  The majority of it is optics related (you better have memorized all formulas) but it covers low vision, refractometry, lab processes, labor and management.  It does convey that you are a "master" of your universe.  I think it is just right.  It is not easy to pass but when you do, you have a total mastery of all things optical.

----------


## Darryl Meister

I wholeheartedly disagree, and I am very saddened that the ABO has diluted the quality and significance of the examination (and, in doing so, the certification in general). Asking management questions on an exam meant to certify someone as a "Master in Ophthalmic Optics" is not only absurd, but obviously detracts from the number of questions that are actually relevant to the title.

_None_ of these exams should ask questions pertaining to business management, since they do not assess your ability as an _ophthalmic dispenser_, but instead assess your ability to run a business (which few opticians do anyway). However, if the ABO feels that it _must_ offer an exam with management questions, why on Earth would you use that same exam for the _Master in Ophthalmic Optics_ certification?

Best regards,
Darryl

post-scriptum,
By the way, the correct answer to that question is *E. 0 Employees*. You don't have to supervise _anyone_ to be a manager; you just have to manage _something_ -- including finances, business affairs, people, inventory, etc.

----------


## wmcdonald

I agree with you Darrell! If is to be called the Msster of Ophthalmic Optics it should be an ophthalmic optics exam, and not be a measure other things that do not involve the topic It was done with good intentions, but should be changed back to the old exam. If it is to measure other knowledge we need to change the title appropriately.

----------


## HarryChiling

I took the same exam and felt the same way.  The business that is in it is not relevant to my trade period.  I can run circles around anyone I know in the lab and perform miracles with frame and lenses but I can't pass the test because I don't know how many people makes me a manager.  Thats definately 1 I got wrong.

----------


## rolandclaur

How long do you have to have your ABO before you are eligible to take the exam?  And is there an NCLE masters that you can get? I know there is an NCLE advanced cert..

----------


## William Walker

After the ABO, you have to be certified for one renewal period in order to sit for the ABO Advanced.  Once you pass that, you can write the masters paper, and if/when accepted by the board, you become an ABO master.


The NCLE doesn't have a masters title, but they do have the NCLE Advanced.  I believe you also have to be NCLE certified for one renewal period before sitting for that as well.

----------


## HarryChiling

I can understand why they put the business part in.  The test is supposed to focus on the managing and running as well as ophthalmic optics, however; I think then the test should have been longer.  The original content should have remained on the test as well as added a section on business.  The fact that they took out good optics questions to fluff the test with business is crap.  I took the test and the only thing I am worried about is the business questions.

----------


## Darryl Meister

> The test is supposed to focus on the managing and running as well as ophthalmic optics,


Harry, the certification is called _Master in Ophthalmic Optics_. No other skill is expressed or implied by that title. And why would the ABO ever need to make a test that focuses on managing and running a business, anyway? If you really must ask a bunch of questions that are irrelevant to ophthalmic optics and dispensing, at least keep the test separate from an advanced test in ophthalmic optics.

----------


## Darryl Meister

I hope I didn't come across the wrong way in my response; I just have a lot of strong feelings regarding this issue. I put a great deal of time and effort into obtaining the Master Certification, and I would rather not see it become just another valueless acronymn in opticianry. I think the ABO has done a great disservice to this program.

----------


## HarryChiling

Don't get me wrong I understand why they have put the business section in there however I don't agree with it.  Also if they were to add it that is not a horrible idea but from what I understand they took valid questions out and replaced them with the business questions.  I just found out today I did not pass the test and guess wich section I scored below average in it was the business.  I am just going to have to go back to the drawing board and try again so if any of you know of any good ophthalmic business books please let me know.

----------


## AWTECH

Any certification whether it is a master in the field of optics or a licensed Real Estate sales person, should as a primary focus make sure that it deals in detail with the subject matter that is being certified.  

The true purpose of such examines is to not only prove the knowledge of the person taking the examine, but to put the public on notice that the field of expertise they are expecting to be dealing in, is certified by an independant third party.

Subjects such as management questions may not be needed in all situations and could be optional, the real question would be if the areas needed to be examined are being tested properly and not replaced by non relevent topics.

From the consumers standpoint you would not want to know someone is certified by the appropriate independant third party, yet for dumbing down of the testing may not be fully qualified.  This is especially true in something like prescription eyewear.  The consumer go to the optical experts with little real knowledge of what is needed to correct their vision.

----------


## Old Nick

I'm new to the forum, so I'm late with this thread.
I passed the Advanced Exam on my second try. I had to study management etc. in which I have little interest.
I would have prefered to be tested on my knowledge of OPTICS!
Love this forum!
Nick

----------


## Alvaro Cordova

Hello everyone.  I would have to agree with Darryl and Old Nick.  An ophthalmic optics test should be about ophthalmic optics.  Also standards should not be diluted.  I will probably take the advanced certification early next year and I don't want a freebee.  I want my advanced certification to mean something.

----------


## HarryChiling

I failed the test due to business managment not due to optics.  I don't think I would have failed it if the business part wasn't on the test.  I hate the fact that I failed, but I have also noticed how inefficient most optical businesses are today.  If we as a whole don't wise up to the fact that this is a business we run then the walmarts and lenscrafters will surely dominate and squeeze us all out.  I agree the business part of the test should not have replaced a single optical question, however I do find it valid.

----------


## wmcdonald

should be a part of the basic education and training of the typical Optician, not a part of the Masters Exam. The exam has less than 20% pass rates and is not easy, so if you plan on taking it, knowing how to edge a pretty pair of spectacles or how to re-string a semi-rimless mount will not get it. You really have to learn something to be successful in this exam.

----------


## fvc2020

Darryl 


I understand the importance of the optics in our testing, however keep in mind to receive your Master certification there is a second step...Its called the paper..I know you know this, but sometimes we forget the entire process..I want the test to show my strenghts in optics, but as someone with almost 20 years as an optician I should know how to take care of my business also.  Business management is as important as knowing all there is to know about crown glass and when you have a +25.00 lens what is the effective power at 36 degrees...Every program someone does for  a regular masters includes business classes.  Nurses, doctors, lawyers etc....IF we want the respect for holding a title of Master of Optics and be equal with other types of Master degrees then so be it


Christina

----------


## wmcdonald

or anywhere CLOSE to a Masters Degree. A Masters Degree is usually 36+ *semester* hours of study (and some significantly more) in a specific area of study. For example, a Masters Degree in Psychology or other human service field would have no business courses. It trains Psychologists. The Masters Certificate is an examination plus a so-called "thesis"; a paper to describe the students synthesis of knowledge at a higher level than the basic knowledge of OPTICS. It was never intended to be a measure of business knowledge. If you want to prove your business acumen then get a degree in business. On top of that, most of the Masters papers are not written in a manner that would be acceptable to pass most undergraduate classes at a college or university and most are not sufficiently referenced. In other words, they would not suffice in an academic institution. I have served as a reviewer for many of them over the years. While the technical information is generally good, the formating and the overall papers are poor. Some of the current reviewers have never stepped foot in a college classeroom and grade them based on technical information alone, which limits them when making comparisons to an academic paper of any type. There are multiple exceptions, but I speak in generalities here. The Masters is no where close to a degree of any type.

----------


## Alvaro Cordova

I have read some of those papers and have seen spelling/grammatical errors.  I do find them to be informative which is what they are all about, but I wish the field of opticianry had a BS route.

----------


## Darryl Meister

> I understand the importance of the optics in our testing, however keep in mind to receive your Master certification there is a second step...Its called the paper..I know you know this, but sometimes we forget the entire process..I want the test to show my strenghts in optics, but as someone with almost 20 years as an optician I should know how to take care of my business also.


My argument to this point is threefold:

1) Everything Warren said about the difference between a graduate degree and this 100 question examination. This is strictly a certification -- nothing more. And, No, medical boards do not include business management questions.

2) The vast _majority_ of opticians do not own their own business. Secondly, business management is _not_ a core competency of _ophthalmic dispensing_. Moreover, questions on business principles frequently fall outside the realm of objective scientific validation (See Harry's earlier example of an ABO "business" question). And how qualified are the people charged with writing these business questions for the ABO exam in the first place?

3) My certificate designates me as a _Master in Ophthalmic Optics_. It doesn't designate me as a _Master in Business Management_ or a _Master in All Things Related to Optical_. These ABO examinations have been watered down enough over the years without intentionally detracting from their content level by replacing optical questions with completely irrelevant (and potentially obscure) management questions. The ABO is simply undermining the value of this certification.

Again, if the ABO feels that it is relevant to offer an examination in optical business principles -- whether they are actually qualified to do so or not -- they should administer it in the form of a separate test, as they do for contact lens dispensing.

The paper is a good idea for a variety of reasons, and is generally judged by the value of its content, with less emphasis placed upon the rules of English composition. Moreover, the purpose of the paper is to expound topics pertaining to dispensing and ophthalmic optics, which is entirely appropriate for this certification.

----------


## wmcdonald

I agree with Darrell that the idea of the paper is good, but if they are designed to compete on par with other disciplines, then those who do the writing need to be able to at least adequately write. Again, content is usually good (even better than good in some cases) but the papers need work.And we do no need folks with NO academic background designing and grading these kinds of things. We need to begin to grow a better educated crop of professionals for the future beginning with an adequate education.

----------


## Alvaro Cordova

> I agree with Darrell that the idea of the paper is good, but if they are designed to compete on par with other disciplines, then those who do the writing need to be able to at least adequately write. Again, content is usually good (even better than good in some cases) but the papers need work.And we do no need folks with NO academic background designing and grading these kinds of things. We need to begin to grow a better educated crop of professionals for the future beginning with an adequate education.


You've hit the nail on the head.

----------


## HarryChiling

I could agree with a separate test on business in opticianry.  I don't think it is a absolutely necesary part to the masters test but it is relevant in many ways.  It is true that most opticiansdon't own their own business, but I would venture to say most opticians also don't have their masters.  Make the business part separate and a requirement alog with a less watered down version of the test and you give more credibility to the whole process.

----------


## Bill MacGillivray

I agree with Darryl, I took the old test and passed. I liked the technical aspect of it, which we need more of in our business. Eliminate the business questions and focus on optics.

----------


## chip anderson

Bill Mac:

Pure Blastemy!  You knows that keeping inventories, and selling are the only thing that's important to todays _optician._   The very idea that an optician should have some knowledge of optics, frames, repair and math is totally hippocritical.
You go wash you mouth out with soap and appologise right away!

Chip

----------


## Darryl Meister

I take no issue with testing opticians on their ability to manage inventory and sell eyewear, although these topics are often subjective and probably outside the scope of a certification body for dispensing eyeglasses (as opposed to managing a dispensary). However, I do take issue with asking such questions on a test described as an examination for the "Master in Ophthalmic Optics" certification.

----------


## Murray O'Brien

My first post on optiboard! Interesting discussion on  your master optician examination. I'm from Melbourne Australia and am in the middle of trying to develop an accreditation program for dispensing opticians. As of next year no Australian state will have government regulation of optical dispensing and we are on a crusade to try and self regulate. Unfortunately the standard of schooing for dispensing opticians has dropped considerably over the past ten years, and this is also our attempt to try and raise the bar again. We have come up with a plan to introduce a three level system of accreditation culminating in a master optician certification which will take six years industry experience to achieve. My question is this: How would I be able to get my hands on a copy of one of your original master optician examination papers? I'm really interested to see the content and perhaps align it somewhat with yours. Also, we're not interested in any management crap in our examination either. My view is if you want to learn management, go to management school!

----------


## HarryChiling

> My first post on optiboard! Interesting discussion on your master optician examination. I'm from Melbourne Australia and am in the middle of trying to develop an accreditation program for dispensing opticians. As of next year no Australian state will have government regulation of optical dispensing and we are on a crusade to try and self regulate. Unfortunately the standard of schooing for dispensing opticians has dropped considerably over the past ten years, and this is also our attempt to try and raise the bar again. We have come up with a plan to introduce a three level system of accreditation culminating in a master optician certification which will take six years industry experience to achieve. My question is this: How would I be able to get my hands on a copy of one of your original master optician examination papers? I'm really interested to see the content and perhaps align it somewhat with yours. Also, we're not interested in any management crap in our examination either. My view is if you want to learn management, go to management school!


You will not get a copy of the test, it's just never going to happen as this would invalidate any further test.  But you can get information as to which subjects are on the tests.

Basic Test - http://www.abo-ncle.org/basiccertifi...pecifications/

Advanced Test - http://www.abo-ncle.org/advancedcert...ncedtestspecs/

Master Paper (with examples) - http://www.abo-ncle.org/abomastersprogram/

Whatever everyone says the portion on inventory management is relevant, an opticians with these certifications is supposed to be at the top of his/her game.  The school soffer these subjects and many practices expect thes tasks of their optical employees so it's relevent.  I am sure everyone would love to believe that the test was the hardest when they took it, bu that is more than likely not the case, keep in mind we grow everyday in this profession especially those that seek out advancement, so it would be more likely that those that took it years ago now consider the test easy, but at the time it was a tough one.  You know what they say about hind sight.

If you want study material for the basic test try this link, it even has a few questions that are similar to those on the test.

http://onlineopticianry.com/wordpress/?p=176

----------


## Murray O'Brien

Thank you for the links and comment.

----------


## Darryl Meister

> Whatever everyone says the portion on inventory management is relevant, an opticians with these certifications is supposed to be at the top of his/her game.


Harry, I respectfully disagree: 1) The Master in Ophthalmic Optics certification was intended as a test of expertise in ophthalmic optics, lenses, and dispensing, as implied by the title, not as a test of whether a given optician is at the top of his or her game, 2) questions pertaining to the management of a dispensary are relevant only to the dispensary manager, and there are a heck of a lot more opticians out there who _aren't_ dispensary managers, and 3) since the number of questions on the exam has not increased, expanding the scope of the exam in this manner serves to water the test down.

----------


## Darryl Meister

> How would I be able to get my hands on a copy of one of your original master optician examination papers? I'm really interested to see the content and perhaps align it somewhat with yours.


Murray, for the level of expertise that you envision for your "Master" certification, I would encourage you to contact the Association of British Dispensing Opticians. They should be willing to provide your organization with some of their tests. Their examinations are considerably more challenging and technical in nature than the current ABO Master examination offered in the US.

----------


## wmcdonald

> You will not get a copy of the test, it's just never going to happen as this would invalidate any further test. But you can get information as to which subjects are on the tests.
> 
> Basic Test - http://www.abo-ncle.org/basiccertifi...pecifications/
> 
> Advanced Test - http://www.abo-ncle.org/advancedcert...ncedtestspecs/
> 
> Master Paper (with examples) - http://www.abo-ncle.org/abomastersprogram/
> 
> Whatever everyone says the portion on inventory management is relevant, an opticians with these certifications is supposed to be at the top of his/her game. The school soffer these subjects and many practices expect thes tasks of their optical employees so it's relevent. I am sure everyone would love to believe that the test was the hardest when they took it, bu that is more than likely not the case, keep in mind we grow everyday in this profession especially those that seek out advancement, so it would be more likely that those that took it years ago now consider the test easy, but at the time it was a tough one. You know what they say about hind sight.
> ...


We respectfully have to disagree on this one, my friend. The schools do teach management courses, but they are seperate courses. For example, we do not teach management topics in Opthalmic Optics 1 or 2, but in management class. The Masters exam is entitled Master of Ophthalmic Optics.  What some may think is needed is a seperate certification in management? ABO/NCLE would love it, but in my mind, an actual education in the subject area would be the best route versus some additional certification. We have enough of those already! The ABO-AC is very difficult right now, as evidenced by a very small pass rate, so I am not saying it was better when I took it in the stone ages. I am saying that in those days it measured knowledge of optics. I think we need to either re-title it, or the Master of Ophthalmic Optics certificate should only focus on what it was designed to measure, optics. We also must improve the process. Some of the papers are excellent content-wise, but the folks who "write" them need to be able to write effectively compared to other disciplines if we are to ever gain the respect we need and deserve. Just food for thought.

----------


## HarryChiling

The trends seem to indicate that the profession is headed in the opposite direction, business will be a more valuable skill in the future of our profession than optics.  It would be wise to hedge bets and include both in any certification.  I could agree that the original test should be kept in it's entirety and busines added but to loose the business element would not be a wise move.

I am sure we are just going to have to agree to disagree on this suject, but I love hearing from both Darryl and Dr McDonald, you keep me grounded. ;)

----------


## Darryl Meister

> The trends seem to indicate that the profession is headed in the opposite direction, business will be a more valuable skill in the future of our profession than optics.


Do you really think so? In my experience, there are fewer and fewer optical dispensaries that are actually owned by opticians. Corporate-owned optical dispensaries have become increasingly accessible to eyewear consumers and many ophthalmologists have begun investing in their own dispensaries to capture that profit center.

In any case, I think both Warren and I believe that business management principles are important, at least to some opticians, but that business management principles are not important on a test of _ophthalmic optics_ knowledge.

----------


## HarryChiling

> Do you really think so? In my experience, there are fewer and fewer optical dispensaries that are actually owned by opticians. Corporate-owned optical dispensaries have become increasingly accessible to eyewear consumers and many ophthalmologists have begun investing in their own dispensaries to capture that profit center.
> 
> In any case, I think both Warren and I believe that business management principles are important, at least to some opticians, but that business management principles are not important on a test of _ophthalmic optics_ knowledge.


Well if you think an opticians only metric is a diopter then I would agree, but in this world of capture rates and year over year growth, performance is measured by the dollar.

----------


## Darryl Meister

> Well if you think an opticians only metric is a diopter then I would agree, but in this world of capture rates and year over year growth, performance is measured by the dollar.


But we are discussing a test on "How to be a Master of Ophthalmic Optics," not a test on "How to Be a Financially Successful Optician." Ophthalmic optics has very little to do with profit margins and revenue.

High sales has nothing to do with your skills as a competent dispenser, only your skills as a competent sales person or business manager. And, frankly, not many people would consider an ABO certification (as opposed to say, an MBA) a meangingful indication of your ability to run a successful business.

----------


## HarryChiling

You know I'd just rather not disagree with you, your right.

----------


## Darryl Meister

Well, it's certainly a controversial topic, and many of us are passionate about our opinions on the matter. I don't know that my opinion is any better than yours, but at least this kind of open dialogue allows other OptiBoard members to see and consider both sides of the issue.

----------


## HarryChiling

> Well, it's certainly a controversial topic, and many of us are passionate about our opinions on the matter.


Not really I have been so much more relieved since I stopped caring.  What difference does it make anyway we could argue all day and still never reach a consensus, but by argueing that the test is harder in the past then it is now, we take another opportunity for an optician to feel success.  They'll never be as great as those that came before them, I am fortunate enough to know what a boob most can be that's knowledge enough for me.

----------


## Darryl Meister

I'm not really arguing that the old test was harder necessarily. Since I never took the new exam, I could only speculate anyway. I just think that the test has now lost focus by including addititional content areas that are not relevant to ophthalmic optics. Nevertheless, I still believe that any optician who has demonstrated true dedication to his or her craft by successfully completing either the Master certification or the ABO Advanced certification should be commended, regardless of the specific content areas of the associated exams.

----------


## Murray O'Brien

Darryl, thanks for your comment regarding the standard of the British test. From what I can deduce, it's becoming a bit of a "gold standard" throughout the world. As an example, I believe the Malaysians now take the British examination to gain registration there. Here in Australia, we all used to do the Guild of Dipensing Opticians diploma and examination, which I didn't realize at the time was the British standard. I will check in with the Brits and see if I can access something there. 
Anyway, it's an interesting discussion. We still do have a separate diploma in ophthalmic practice management available here. I don't think that we will be making management questions part of our test however. The thing that is obviously lacking here is knowledge of optics. I run a small fitting laboratory, and I must say the lack of knowledge of even so called "qualified" dispensers is astounding. 
The main driver of the lowered standard here is a Luxottica owned chain called OPSM. They are about 50% of the market and have enormous clout due to the fact that they take on so many dispensing trainees. They recently changed their educational provider to one which would dumb down the course, allow more students to graduate, thus providing the company with the government kick back for having got another dumb kid through the course. It's just about money here, nothing more.

----------


## Barry Santini

I know that Dr. McDonald may disagree with me, but I don't think that its education that stands in the way of optician advancement.

Rather, it's that age-old saw..._money$!_

With wage level no where near what they must be for truly competant optician to remain an employee, the motivated ones simply move into positions of ownership or partnership in order to be rewarded at the level of their skill set.

It's so sad when management/corporations make most of the profit on the backs of the truly dedicated.

I think you could raise the bar on education of opticians, but there would not be a commensurate increase in the level of compensation. Therefore, knowing how to succeed in business is _essential_ to those skilled opticians who want to remain in this industry.

For the rest...I offer a heartfelt "thank you." 

Barry

----------


## wmcdonald

Barry, Barry,
How do you know that education would not make a difference? The terminal degree for Opticians in the AAS or some form of it, which is the same for many technical fields. Unfortunatly in most states the schools are poorly attended. Most Opticians train now through what they call "apprenticeship" which is nothing more than on-the-job cheap labor. Little actual training occurs and these folks are left to train themselves. That dumbs us down with every new generation, and we no longer attract the best and brightest as we used to do. That said, Opticians still make a substantial salary in many states, including New York. An Optician in NC will make 40-50K, more than school teachers that require a bachelor's degree. How much can you pay someone with a high school education? Most Opticians now measure PDs and take seg heights and say thank you very much, quite a difficult professional task, wouldn't you agree? Now remember.....I said most. There are many competent folks on this very board like Darryl, and Harry and your yourself, Barry, but you are not the norm. Some on Optiboard complain with great trepidation about passing the dreaded ABO! That test is very basic, and in fact to prove it many years ago, we took a secretary with no experience who did not even wear glasses, and had her read some selccted material for a month. We got them to allow her to test and she made an 80! Someone adequately trained would pass that easily. We are judged by our lowest common denominator and the only way to improve that situation is through education to right the ship. Along with that education should come a commensurate increase in scope of practice. ODs did it. Nurses did it. Dental Hygenists did it. Why do we still argue a point like the need for education? Once we start moving in that right direction salaries will rise, just as they did for ODs. It is our only hope. I wish you all well, and while I know I will have absolutely no effect on Barry, I hope some will at least consider my points.

----------


## Roy R. Ferguson

Hi Guys:

Warren and Darrel are hitting excellent points as usual. As many of you know I have developed, validated, and now administer an entry level practical examination for opticians seeking licensure in several states. The following are a few results from the last exam. The percentages listed indicate the number of candidates who could correctly answer this question.


Measure prism thinning 48%
Analyze the lens for unwanted vertical prism 44%
Determine the add power for a standard bifocal 44%


I feel these numbers correctly reflect the knowledge level of the average optician. While there are those who will argue that our field is well served by our current standards, test results reflect otherwise. Perhaps this explains why the ABO “advanced certification” has been so watered down. In my opinion, we need formal education, more in-depth optical knowledge, and higher entry standards. 

Roy

----------


## Barry Santini

Good points again, Warren. It' just that between ny's inability to set higher standards for fear of cracking those fragile student eggs (or is it egos?), and my own parochial standards, the lowest common denominator and associated wage rules.

It's simple: you either are for higher standards, or you are not. Enough of compromise to soothe those who think the standards ask too much.

In the old days, NY had the toughest and fairest exam. It took four full days to complete. Compare that with 3 hrs today.

If you really believe there's another way, I'm all ears!

Barry

----------


## wmcdonald

The way to a better future (and that is the key, the future) can be readily found in the route ODs, Nurses, and others have taken. Educate, and then legislate. We will get absolutely nowhere without education. And I do not speak of these half-degrees.....I mean a legitimate, college education that covers the full spectrum of competencies an Optician may do, both now and in the future. The problem is, many of the leaders have no education and therefore do not support it. We MUST try to elect leaders who will begin to plan for the future, and make education a part of the plan. We are what we are currently, and the transformation will be slow. It took ODs 20 years of courses before they could use any pharmaceutical agents, but they achieved their goals. Now they have educated themselves and enacted laws that give them great freedom and latitude. If we begin now, we can develop a better prepared Optcian for the future. If we wait much longer, technology just may replace us. My career is close to the end.......I want things to be better for our colleagues of the future.

----------


## Roy R. Ferguson

Warren, you and I have fought this battle for more years than I would like to recall.  We both have heard all the lame excuses.  Opticians have argued that the chains would never allow the field access to education since this might require greater pay.  Unfortunately, when we had the opportunity to pursue formal education in Tennessee, it was the opticians that fought long and hard to destroy the goal.

How about the canard that Optometry would prevent education because that in a hundred or so years it might allow opticians access to refractions.  Again, in Tennessee it was the opticians state society that undercut education, not Optometrists.  

Our field is saddled with an unmotivated leadership determined to remain the only uneducated branch of the health care industry.  This is an unfortunate truth that seems to defy all solutions.  Rather than push for change, each leadership cycle brings forward another batch of individuals determined to just do their time and tack another certificate on the wall. 

Complaints are posted on OptiBoard bemoaning the sad state of opticianry and how there is a lack of respect from the other Os.  This stems from opticians wanting to equate hanging out in an optical office for a few years and passing a couple of risible tests with that of a college degree.  Respect is earned, not given.  If you want respect from educated professionals start with an education.

Now that I have vented, the flaming can commence.

Roy

----------


## Murray O'Brien

The parellels between the situation in the U.S. and Australia are amazing. I just think that we're a bit further along the path toward the complete demise of optical dispensing. If you want a look at your future, look here gentlemen, and I suggest that you be very worried!
Governments in Australia have been in a deregulatory frame of mind for about twenty years now. In the three states here that had regulated optical dispensing, two have gone and the last will be gone this time next year. 
Big corporations have had a hand in dumbing down the level of education and the prerequistes for entry, as all they are after is a source of cheap labor and hand outs from government, and by dumbing down the courses it means less of their ex-employees will leave and go into competition against them. Since the demise of our four year apprenticeship and diploma into a two year traineeship, very few young dispensers have struck out and started up their own business. The corporate plan has succeeded!
It seems the powers that be don't consider opticianry an important or worthwhile endeavour. We all know differently, so I think it is a matter of how we sell the message to the general public, governement and associated professions of the importance of well educated and trained opticians.

----------


## Barry Santini

Opticians won't be able to do anything w/o money. Warren you're right about education, but it's so much more than that. Money, education, on going training, and most of all, respect from our employers for what we do.

Unfortunately, our American eithical culture has been persuaded by adulation to the golden calf, as exemplified by Wall Street.

For me, it's about gettin' on that next rocketship: I've earned my skill set. Slavish devotion to money via wall street, should be told "no vacency"!

Rant off!

B

----------


## Barry Santini

Roy,
I agree with you. I've seen this underminIng firsthand in NY. 

And when you flame Roy, you're hot!

B

----------


## chip anderson

Even if we had money, we are too tight to part with it.  In my state we could have had licenseing back when you could buy the legislature for 
$5.00 a vote and these clowns wouldn't put up a dime.  I was working for about $150.00 a week and offered to put up $5,000.00 personally.  Couldn't get the very prosperous optical owner exec's in our state society to put up a dime.  
They let it all slip from thier hands.

Chip

----------


## Wes

As it somewhat goes to the other thread currently in this forum.  I took both of the AC exams, and passed both the first time out.  Both were very comprehensive.  The ABO-AC I found rather easy to pass, as this is my field and has been for many years.  The management questions were unrelated to the title Master in Ophthalmic Optics, true, but this test IS NOT the  Master in Ophthalmic Optics test anymore. It is the Advanced NOCE.  We can call it semantics, but that is the current format.  If you want the title, Master in Ophthalmic Optics, write the paper.  On a side note, I found the Advanced CLRE much more difficult, due to that not being my primary field.  

As far as education goes, We may never see opticianry educate itself out of the pit it is in, but at least with difficult certifications like these, the cream of the crop can still set themselves apart from the rest.  I have issued a challenge to my optical lab co-workers that if any of them successfully pass one of the advanced examinations, I WILL PAY FOR IT.  I do not think I am in any danger of losing money.
Wes

----------


## Yellow

I agree that we shouldn't be dumbed down, I've just finished my two year certification through Lux and RMIT in Aus and now I really don't know where I stand in comparison with my non Lux/ RMIT peers. It's hard as I believe that everything was covered and have not had a situation I haven't been able to remedy at work 
(but that might be because of you guys!!), but another OD thought it was comical that I wasted the last two years of my life. 

If I had a choice of providers I would have done some research into what was best, but it wasn't up to me.
I am wondering if anyone has an old final exam from another university that I could have a look at? 
Maybe then I'll be able to make a comparison.

----------


## musicvirtuoso

I full-heartedly agree with Darryl! I'm studying right now to take the test in September and I do not see the relevance of including business questions on a certification exam for Ophthalmic Optics. If these are to be added to this test, the designation should be changed to "Master of Ophthalmic Management" or "Master of Ophthalmic-Related Business". The Masters (or Advanced) certification is not a requirement for opening a business and it does not lend it's taker to open a business, therefore the need for these questions is not founded. I feel like I'm wasting the time I could be using for studying oh, I don't know... optics... on studying useless junk.

----------


## Wes

Musicvirtuoso, see below. 




> The management questions were unrelated to the title Master in Ophthalmic Optics, true, but this test IS NOT the  Master in Ophthalmic Optics test anymore. It is the Advanced NOCE.  We can call it semantics, but that is the current format.  If you want the title, Master in Ophthalmic Optics, write the paper. .
> Wes


the Master in Ophthalmic Optics certification is now a seperate entity from the Advanced Optician certification. The AC exam is a prerequisite, but is no longer the Master's exam. I feel it accurately reflects the knowledge needed to perform as an advanced optician; knowledge of optics, certainly, but also of diseases, pretesting, and business management. 
Let's be honest here. Unless you're a lens designer or work in a surfacing laboratory, you probably don't spend a lot of time contemplating too much in the way of ophthalmic optics. The Advanced Certification exam content covers what most upscale employers would want from a seasoned optician. 
I hold both Advanced Certifications, the Master in Ophthalmic Optics, and a BS with a major in business. I work in a surfacing lab and dispense part time. Take my words for what they're worth.  Wes

----------


## Darryl Meister

> I feel it accurately reflects the knowledge needed to perform as an advanced optician... business management...Let's be honest here. Unless you're a lens designer or work in a surfacing laboratory, you probably don't spend a lot of time contemplating too much in the way of ophthalmic optics.


At the same time, how many opticians are really in a management role? I would say no more than 1 out of 5.

I agree that business management represents a skillset that could potentially benefit many opticians, and anyone else for that matter, but until the ABO renames the Master in Ophthalmic Optics certification to something else, like the Advanced ECP Certification, it is still outside the implied scope of the certification.

While I do believe that knowledge of certain aspects of sight testing will benefit individuals who fit, make, and dispense eyeglasses, the incorporation of content areas that do not specifically pertain to ophthalmic dispensing dilute the focus of the examination and, therefore, the quality of the results.

In fact, opticians are probably more likely to dispense contact lenses than perform pretesting, refraction, or manage a business. Yet there are no questions regarding contact lens dispensing on the advanced ABO certification exam or former Master exam. Why? Because the ABO/NCLE offers a separate exam that focuses specifically on contact lenses, as they should. The new Advanced ABO exam seems to me to have become a "catch-all" for everything else, yet the actual length of the exam is still no longer than a typical high school final.

Best regards,
Darryl

----------


## Uilleann

Curiously - what is the current average attention given to business management in med or optometry schools these days?

----------


## Wes

Perhaps they should have kept the Master exam as it was and created the Advanced exam as a seperate entity?  But who would take both as they're so closely related in content anyway?

The new exam was created to reflect the skillset needed to manage an office and dispensary. These are the skills most employers want from a top level optician. It has a 5 percent pass rate from what I hear. Not too shabby, and you're right. It is a catch-all. 

No reference is made anywhere that the new advanced exam is the old master in ophthalmic optics exam although one may  infer...  If it were I would agree completely with you. It is not that now; it is a higher level certification. 

I'm not disagreeing with you about what should be. I'm just stating what is. I constantly see people saying these things shouldn't be in the masters exam. Well they're not!  They're in the Advanced NOCE. 
Ps.  I would like to add, Darryl, that I think you're tops in optics on this board, so no disrespect. I still say were arguing about semantics. 
Best regards to you,
Wes

----------


## musicvirtuoso

I do understand that this is not the exam for the "Masters" certification. But, if you look at it one way, aren't both the Basic and the Advanced NOCE pathways to the Masters certification? After all, each exam is a prerequisite for the following subsequently more difficult one (yes, and to reiterate, I do understand that the Masters certification is obtained by writing a thesis, not taking an exam). I may also be arguing semantics as mentioned earlier, but aren't all three certifications in the same realm of subject matter (they do have the same root in there abbreviated designations, ie: ABOC, ABO-AC, ABOM)? And if Business management is so important in the qualifications as an optician, why aren't there business related questions on the standard exam? Surely, as a certified optician of any level, you'd want to have even marginal strength in all areas that are required of an optician. I may just be venting because of how much I do not like studying business...:hammer:

----------


## optical24/7

Music, if it's any consolation to you, the version I took last Nov. only had a handful of business or agency questions (ANSI, OSHA, ect ).

Mine was mostly path, prism, formula and a lot of refraction questions.(a lot!) Concentrate more on those.

----------


## Darryl Meister

> Perhaps they should have kept the Master exam as it was and created the Advanced exam as a seperate entity? But who would take both as they're so closely related in content anyway?


I have a lot of opinions on this matter, but I will spare the 'Board my diatribe for now. ;) There are a lot of very passionate opinions regarding this topic, and all too often such heated debate ends badly on OptiBoard.




> The new exam was created to reflect the skillset needed to manage an office and dispensary. These are the skills most employers want from a top level optician.


I'm not suggesting that the new ABO-AC examination doesn't have a place or offers no value. I just feel that a certification described as a "Master in Ophthalmic Optics" should, in fact, only be conferred upon someone who has adequately demonstrated an advanced level of knowledge of ophthalmic optics and lenses.

If there really is value in testing someone on potentially related subjects, like business management, then a separate exam should continue to be administered for the ABOM certification. Right now, the only distinction between the ABO-AC and ABOM certifications is a 2,000-word paper, which in my mind makes one of these certifications redundant.




> No reference is made anywhere that the new advanced exam is the old master in ophthalmic optics exam although one may infer... If it were I would agree completely with you.


I'm not suggesting that the title of the exams are the same, or that the titles should even matter. After all, how many opticians even remember that the "ABO Exam" is really called the "National Opticianry Competency Exam?" But the Master certifications are the same, and this is all that really matters. You still get a certificate from the ABO that reads "Master in Ophthalmic Optics," as well as the "ABOM" credential.




> I would like to add, Darryl, that I think you're tops in optics on this board, so no disrespect.


Absolutely none taken. I respect the fact that every person is entitled to his or her own opinion, and I am happy to entertain any opinion that is respectfully submitted and reasonably supported, as yours always are.

Best regards,
Darryl

----------


## musicvirtuoso

> Music, if it's any consolation to you, the version I took last Nov. only had a handful of business or agency questions (ANSI, OSHA, ect ).
> 
> Mine was mostly path, prism, formula and a lot of refraction questions.(a lot!) Concentrate more on those.


Actually, that is a consolation... I feel a little better.  :Cool:

----------


## Barry Santini

What do you mean, "business management"?

The Reader's Digest version of 
The 5 Point Business Managment for Opticians:

1. Take all Insurance Plans
2. Open 7 days a week
3. Operate a website 24/7
4. Blame the lab for everything, and get all redone at no charge
5. Get blamed for everything, and never EVER bill the client nor the referring doctor for any of their contributions to your bad and less profitable days.

Did I miss anything?

Oh yeah, one more thing: NEVER think you're wrong!

B

----------


## musicvirtuoso

> What do you mean, "business management"?
> 
> The Reader's Digest version of 
> The 5 Point Business Managment for Opticians:
> 
> 1. Take all Insurance Plans
> 2. Open 7 days a week
> 3. Operate a website 24/7
> 4. Blame the lab for everything, and get all redone at no charge
> ...


 LOL. True!;);)

----------

