# Optical Forums > Progressive Lens Discussion Forum >  What type of progressive:Nikon i or Varilux comfort?

## volan

Hi there;

I was wondering if someone on this board could help me out. I currently have 2 pairs of glasses. One is a general wear pair and the other is an office/computer pair. Both are progressive with + prescriptions on top and bottom and with astigmatism correction.

The general wear pair have a depth of 16mm and have Nikon i lenses in them. The computer wear glasses are deeper and have Nikon on-line lenses in them.

Now it's time to change my prescription and here's where my dilemma is. I'd prefer to hang on to my current frames (and save the money of buying new frames) because my frames are in great condition. My general wear frames are Flexons and I don't know what the other is. My optician is suggesting I change from Nikon i to Varilux comfort. Her reasoning is that the Varilux has a larger intermediate and a larger reading area, but you need a minimum of 18mm depth which means I need new frames. But my optician says that she can't guarantee that by purchasing the deeper lens I won't need an office/computer pair. The intermediate/reading area may still be too small for 8hrs a day of reading computer screen/printed documents.

I'd like to know from people on this board if there is an appreciable difference between the Nikon i and Varilux comfort with respect to intermediate (for computer screen distance) and reading (for printed documents). If so what are the differences. Does anyone here have a recommendation?

Thank you for your help.

----------


## Jedi

I don't think there will be a significant difference in the reading area between the too, at least not significant enough to warrant new frames. I would still encourage having a dedicated pair for office work, especially if you are spending 8hr a day on a computer or reading. I deal with a lot of business clients and engineers (I work in a downtown dispensary) and have had a lot of success with computer progressives or lined bi-focals in a computer set-up (intermediate vision up top, reading in the segment).

----------


## volan

> I don't think there will be a significant difference in the reading area between the too, at least not significant enough to warrant new frames. I would still encourage having a dedicated pair for office work, especially if you are spending 8hr a day on a computer or reading. I deal with a lot of business clients and engineers (I work in a downtown dispensary) and have had a lot of success with computer progressives or lined bi-focals in a computer set-up (intermediate vision up top, reading in the segment).


Hey, thanks for your input I really appreciate it.  

In your opinion there is not much difference in reading area between the two frames, but how about intermediate?  My optician says that that's where the comfort really outdoes the Nikon.  She said that the Nikon i intermediate area is almost non-existant.

I think you're also saying that if I choose to get new frames and get the Varilux you'd still recommend getting an office pair of glasses.  Correct?

Thanks again.

Again, thanks for your help.

----------


## Happylady

I have a study done at the Ohio State University Medical center where a number of different progressives are compared to each other. This was done using a plano(no rx)distance and a +2.00 add. You mentioned that you wear a + prescription on the top which will tend to give you a narrower near area in a progressive.

The Nikon lens was not tested, but the Comfort was. Now the Comfort is a very nice progressive, but it was not one of the top rated progressives for near or intermediate.

Do you have to put it in a frame at 16 high? There are only a few lenses that can be fit well at that height. Any progressive will give you more reading and intermediate if you can get a fitting height of 18 or 20.

Let me know what fitting height you need and I will tell you the top rated choices.

----------


## volan

> Do you have to put it in a frame at 16 high? There are only a few lenses that can be fit well at that height. Any progressive will give you more reading and intermediate if you can get a fitting height of 18 or 20.
> 
> Let me know what fitting height you need and I will tell you the top rated choices.


The 16mm limitation is due to the fact that my current frames are 16mm and I'd like to keep them because they are apparantly very good frames and still in excellent condition. Of course I do not have to keep my current frames. There are 2 frames at the opticians that my wife seemed to like, but both of them look very similar to my current frames, both of them are 18mm high.

So, please tell me the top rated lens for 16mm and the top rated for 18mm. Like I said, because the "new" frames look so much like my current frames there's really no cosmetic reason to change. The only reason to change would be a functional one.

Also, Varilux and Nikon have a new coating.  Nikon calls it "ice" it apparantly helps you keep your glasses cleaner by making it easier to wipe the lint off.  Does your top-rated lens have a similar coating?

Thank you...I really appreciate all this advice/help.

----------


## Happylady

Right now you are using a special computer lens while working on the computer, correct? Are you trying to do away with this lens and just have one pair that would work for everything? Is your computer screen straight ahead or do you look down on it? If it is straight ahead, then no standard progressive is going to work well for all day use. You would have to raise you chin to use the intermediate area of any progressive. I agree with your optician that a computer lens is the best choice for someone working 8 hours a day at a computer.

There are tradeoffs in progressive lenses. The ones that are best at the computer aren't usually the best at distance or near. I could find no intermediate rating for any lenses at 16 or 18 mm fitting height. I could find near at those heights. I could find near/intermediate ratings at 22 mm fitting. I could find intermediate with no fitting height mentioned. I could find distance, intermediate, and near at 18 mm. 

What are you interested in?

----------


## volan

> Right now you are using a special computer lens while working on the computer, correct?


Correct




> Are you trying to do away with this lens and just have one pair that would work for everything?


Yes, I would like to do that




> Is your computer screen straight ahead or do you look down on it? If it is straight ahead, then no standard progressive is going to work well for all day use. You would have to raise you chin to use the intermediate area of any progressive. I agree with your optician that a computer lens is the best choice for someone working 8 hours a day at a computer.


The computer screen is pretty close to straight ahead.  The top of the screen is at my eye level when looking straight ahead (as per proper ergonomic considerations).  I can lower it by about 2 inches if you think that will be better for me.

It would be my preference to do away with the second (computer) pair, but it sounds like I should stay with my current setup wherer I have a regular pair and a computer pair.  In that case I would use my current frames and get Nikon lenses since my current regular wear glasses have a 16mm height.

----------


## Happylady

Lowering the screen would help, because the part of the lens you look straight through is distance only.

All standard progressives have small intermediate areas, but the ones designed for frames with a 16 mm fitting height have even smaller ones. To make a progressive work in such a small frame the channel(which is the intermediate area) is shortened.

Just for near the progressives with the largest reading areas at 16 fitting height are from best to worst:

Shamir Picolo
Rodenstock Life XS
AO Compact
Sola VIP
Hoya Summit CD
Sola Max
Kodak Precise
Vision Ease Outlook

At 18 mm Shamir Picolo
AO Compact
Rodenstock Life XS
Sola VIP
Sola Max
Outlook
Super No Line
Precise
Comfort

For general use considering distance, intermediate, and near and downgrading lenses with a lot of astigmatism at 18 mm:

J&J Difinity
Shamir Genesis
AO b'Active
Younger Image
AO pro 15
Sig Kodak
Gradual Top
Outlook
Panamic
Pentex AF Mini

Ratings just for intermediate(but no fitting height mentioned):

Zeiss Gradual Top
J&J Definity
Pentex AF Mini
Sig Nav Precsn
AO Pro 15 
Hoyalux ECP
Rodenstock Life AT
Sola Max
AP b'Active 
Sig Kodak
Hoya Summit CD

As you can see there is no perfect lens. You are probably wise to keep using two pairs. If you try to get the pair with a fitting height or 16 to work well at the computer then you will sacrifice your distance or end up with a lens with lots of astigmatism.

There are many progressives that weren't tested at all. The Varilux Ellipse can be fit down to 14 mm and wasn't tested. Sola One has a fitting height of 18 and wasn't tested. I have personally used this lens and it works very well for near and intermediate at 18 mm  for me but my computer screen is low, when I look straight ahead I look over the top of it.

----------


## volan

OK.  So for general use 16mm frames I'd be more interested in better distance viewing (for driving, etc) and also a fairly decent reading area.  The "channel" is not that important because in everyday situations seeing things at an intermediate distance is not that crucial.  In that case am I correct to understand that the Shamir Picolo it the best lens tested for 16mm (that gives good reading area and good distance)?  Or did I misinterpret the results you posted?  I'll talk to my optician about Shamir, but I have a feeling that the lab they use only deals with Essilor and I think that both Nikon and Varilux are Essilor (but I'm not certain).

If I choose a particular brand for my general glasses should I also use the same brand for my computer glasses?  Is there a problem using 2 different brands?  My optician suggests that I choose the same brand because the "quirks" will be the same.

Also, I've never used "transition" lenses and I was wondering if it is something worthwhile considering since I usually get clip-ons.

----------


## QDO1

Stick with the lens designs you allready use.  they are quite complimentary with each other 
The regular Nikon lens has a smallish intermediate, but excelent distance vision.  The Online design has a bucket full of intermediate in it - the comprimises each pair are offset by the strengths of the other pair.  Seriously at 16 mm you wont find a lens that does everything as well as you want to

There are 2 versions of the Nikon i series, a short and long progression.  the short progression lens is similar to most other short progression lenses - somewhat lacking in Intermediate.  What does offset the Nikon i series of lenses lens apart from the Varilux Comfort is its overall lack of distortion in the distance

At such a short progression length the varilux comfort will have more intermediate area, but a seriously reduced reading area

If you insist on such shallow frame designs then the only options are multiple pairs of spectacles, with different comprimises in each pair

----------


## Happylady

The Piccolo is great for reading at 16, but I am not sure about the distance area. I have never worn it, but someone I work with has and she liked it. 

If you are happy with the progressive that you have for general use I suggest you stay with it. Another one to consider if you aren't happy is the Varilux Ellipse which can be put in a frame with a fitting height as low as 14. I have never worn it, but I have sold several with no problems yet.

I have never worried about keeping someone in the same brand of computer lens and standard progressive lens.
Transition lenses are very popular and I sell a lot of them, but they aren't a substitute for a clip or sunglass. They don't darken in a car, they might not get as dark as you would like on very hot days, and they aren't polarized. I often sell Transition lenses AND a clip.

----------


## volan

Thank you to everyone who posted here.

I think I'm going to keep my 2 pairs of glasses without transitions because it's the driving that I need sunglasses for.

I'll talk to my optician again about choices in lenses and I'll be sure to mention what has been discussed in this forum.  

My general glasses are 16mm and my computer glasses are substantially larger so I have much more choice in that and if using the same brand for both glasses is not an issue it increses my choices much more.

Thanks again for all your help.

----------


## volan

> Another one to consider if you aren't happy is the Varilux Ellipse which can be put in a frame with a fitting height as low as 14. I have never worn it, but I have sold several with no problems yet.


 Thanks for the tip.



> I have never worried about keeping someone in the same brand of computer lens and standard progressive lens.


I'll get my general wear lenses done first using my existing frames and either the Nikon i or your Varilux Ellipse suggestion (depending on my optician).  Then I'll get my reading glasses done.  I do not know the height of those glasses yet, but when I do, do you mind if I post on this thread and get your recommendation for a computer/reading pair?

Thank you.

----------


## keagles2

Since you have a Nikon which is one of the best lenses available the only step to take from that is the Varilux Panamic as it has a proven periferial adavntage over the old Comfort lens.Luck to ya !

----------


## volan

> Since you have a Nikon which is one of the best lenses available the only step to take from that is the Varilux Panamic as it has a proven periferial adavntage over the old Comfort lens.Luck to ya !


Thanks for the info, but would you mind elaborating?  Are you talking about my 16mm general wear glasses or my computer/reading glasses?

Thanks.

----------


## Chris Ryser

> Hi there; 
> *The general wear pair have a depth of 16mm and have Nikon i lenses in them. The computer wear glasses are deeper and have Nikon on-line lenses in them.*
> .


If 16mm is the total  height of the lens you are not getting much out of those lenses. You should give the toal correct height and or the fitting height in order to kook at your problem.

----------


## QDO1

> If 16mm is the total height of the lens you are not getting much out of those lenses. You should give the toal correct height and or the fitting height in order to kook at your problem.


I agree - which one of the two i series lenses do you have?

The i15 series is specified as a minimum height of 21mm and overall depth of 30mm. the i13 series is specified to a a minimum height 18mm and minimum overall depth of 27mm

I have been dispensing these for ages, and previously the x series of lenses that the i series replaced. I know for a fact you cant push those measurements either, if you do then you just dont get the full range available from the lens

*By the way*
Nikon W12 series lenses are specified at specified as a minimum height of 15mm and overall depth of 26mm, and W14 series lenses are specified at specified as a minimum height of 17mm and overall depth of 28mm. Results so far, when dispensed to the right patients for the right usage, with the w series are excelent

The x, i a w series of lenses are very good - when you check them on a focimeter, and (on a manual focimeter) the lack of distortion seen is up there with the best I have seen

----------

