# Conversation and Fun > Just Conversation >  Prison reform ~ the way it should be!~

## Optician Magician

USA JAIL - SOME INTERESTING READINGTO THOSE OF YOU NOT FAMILIAR WITH JOE ARPAIO, HE IS THE MARICOPA COUNTY SHERIFF (ARIZONA)
AND HE KEEPS GETTING ELECTED OVER AND OVER AGAIN.These are some of the reasons why:
Sheriff Joe Arpaio created the 'tent city jail' to save Arizona from spending tens of
millions of dollars on another expensive prison complex.
He has jail meals down to 20 cents a serving and charges the inmates for them.
He banned smoking and pornographic magazines in the jails, and took away their
weightlifting equipment and cut off all but 'G' movies. He says:
'They're in jail to pay a debt to society not to build muscles so they can assault
innocent people when they leave.'
He started chain gangs to use the inmates to do free work on county and city
projects and save taxpayer's money.
Then he started chain gangs for women so he wouldn't get sued for discrimination.
He took away cable TV until he found out there was a federal court order that
required cable TV for jails. So he hooked up the cable TV again but only allows the
Disney channel and the weather channel.
When asked why the weather channel, he replied: 'So these morons will know how
hot it's gonna be while they are working on my chain gangs.'
He cut off coffee because it has zero nutritional value and is therefore a waste of
taxpayer money. When the inmates complained, he told them, 'This isn't the
Ritz/Carlton. If you don't like it, don't come back.'
He also bought the Newt Gingrich lecture series on US history that he pipes into the
jails. When asked by a reporter if he had any lecture series by a Democrat, he
replied that a democratic lecture series that actually tells the truth for a change
would be welcome and that it might even explain why 95% of the inmates were in
his jails in the first place.
With temperatures being even hotter than usual in Phoenix (116 degrees just set a
new record for June 2nd 2007), the Associated Press reported: About 2,000 inmates
living in a barbed wire surrounded tent encampment at the Maricopa County Jail
have been given permission to strip down to their government-issued pink boxer
shorts.
On the Wednesday, hundreds of men wearing pink boxer shorts were overheard
chatting in the tents, where temperatures reached 128 degrees.
'This is hell. It feels like we live in a furnace,' said Ernesto Gonzales, an inmate for
2 years with 10 more to go. 'It's inhumane.'
Joe Arpaio, who makes his prisoners wear pink, and eat bologna sandwiches, is not
one bit sympathetic. 'Criminals should be punished for their crimes - not live in
luxury until it's time for parole, only to go out and commit more crimes so they can
come back in to live on taxpayers money and enjoy things many taxpayers can't
afford to have for themselves.'
The same day he told all the inmates who were complaining of the heat in the
tents: 'It's between 120 to 130 degrees in Iraq and our soldiers are living in tents
too, and they have to walk all day in the sun, wearing full battle gear and get shot
at, and they have not committed any crimes, so shut your damned mouths!'
Way to go, Sheriff! If all prisons were like yours there would be a lot less crime and
we would not be in the current position of running out of prison spaces.
If you agree, pass this on.
If not, just delete it.
Sheriff Joe was just re-elected as Sheriff in Maricopa County, Arizona

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## chip anderson

You didn't mention that crime is down there, many undesirable elements have left the region entirely.  And very, very few visit the facilities there twice.

Chip

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## Steve Machol

Uh, crime is WAY up on Phoenix and Maricopa county. In fact the crime rate is MUCH higher than before he was elected Sheriff.

I don't have a problem with how criminals are treated as long as it's Constitutional. However that Sheriff's Department has a very poor track record of stepping on innocent people's rights. Anyone even halfway knowledgeable about what is going on in this county would know that there is also a very dark side to this man and his policies.

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## Optician Magician

I don't know much (anything really) about this man or his policies, but I really like his ideas on jail.  Someone sent me this article and I thought that it was interesting.  I personally think that criminals get way too many perks in prison.  I was just reading about two boys that murdered a girl in cold blood and they have links to a myspace page for each of them that they update.  Thats too much.  Really, I think if you do a *serious* crime, you should go to jail and serve your sentence contemplating your crime... not watching tv, surfing the web, weight lifting, or doing anything enjoyable.  Maybe if jails were more like this one in the article, people thinking about commiting a crime would reconsider.  :finger:

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## Websta

I'm with Optician Magician on this. Criminals do get too much freedom (in whatever country you are!)
It is not a holiday camp or retreat for them. They are there to repay their debt to society (bring back chain gangs who can go around and clean up the highways and help build infrastructure, I say!!) 
They want to act like outsiders, then treat them as such. I am all for treating people fair, but what some of these people do is beyond comprehension......and they should not expect any sympathy from law abiding citizens.

My only question is now..........when will it become a franchise!!:cheers:

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## gemstone

Sorry guys!  No more here. :cheers:

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## Spexvet

It's all fun and games until one of you is in the wrong place at the wrong time and thrown in one of their jails through a miscarriage of justice.

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## kidsparrow

Wow, gemstone, that's the most offensive thing I've ever seen posted on here. Or anywhere, in a long time. :(

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## gemstone

I see no offense, meant none.  If you really want to be offended look in the RSS feeds.

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## Judy Canty

I must agree.  That visual is offensive in the extreme.  You would do us all a favor by editing it out of your post.

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## MarcE

The only problem I have with this Sheriff is calling the inmates "morons".  It sounds like he has a personal vendetta.  I wouldn't doubt that he has a side that is not in accordance with the laws.

I can agree with the tent city, lack of coffee, spartan meals, no weightlifting equipment (although I think some sports would be good), working for living, etc.
I think he should change the Disney channel to CSPAN.

I wish more prisons would focus on rehabilitation instead of the easiest path of just providing comfortable housing.

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## gemstone

:Confused:

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## Judy Canty

*Question:* What is Ramadan?
Ramadan is the ninth month of the Islamic lunar calendar. Every day during this month, Muslims around the world spend the daylight hours in a complete fast.
*Answer:* During the blessed month of Ramadan, Muslims all over the world abstain from food, drink, and other physical needs during the daylight hours. As a time to purify the soul, refocus attention on God, and practice self-sacrifice, Ramadan is much more than just not eating and drinking. 
Muslims are called upon to use this month to re-evaluate their lives in light of Islamic guidance. We are to make peace with those who have wronged us, strengthen ties with family and friends, do away with bad habits -- essentially to clean up our lives, our thoughts, and our feelings. The Arabic word for "fasting" (_sawm_) literally means "to refrain" - and it means not only refraining from food and drink, but from evil actions, thoughts, and words. 
During Ramadan, every part of the body must be restrained. The tongue must be restrained from backbiting and gossip. The eyes must restrain themselves from looking at unlawful things. The hand must not touch or take anything that does not belong to it. The ears must refrain from listening to idle talk or obscene words. The feet must refrain from going to sinful places. In such a way, every part of the body observes the fast. Therefore, fasting is not merely physical, but is rather the total commitment of the person's body and soul to the spirit of the fast. Ramadan is a time to practice self-restraint; a time to cleanse the body and soul from impurities and re-focus one's self on the worship of God.

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## FullCircle

> Sorry guys! No more here. :cheers:


Thanks.:)

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## Judy Canty

Thank you.

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## NgCognito

I have read this story several times over.  I love it every time!
 :Cool:

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## chip anderson

Don't you think we should just tell the inmates we are sorry that we as a society drove them to crime, give them a check and a free house?
It would be so much more "enlightened."

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## kidsparrow

> Don't you think we should just tell the inmates we are sorry that we as a society drove them to crime, give them a check and a free house?
> It would be so much more "enlightened."


I know you're being sarcastic, but I wonder if a lot of criminals aren't merely neglected mentally ill persons. 

Frankly, I AM sorry that people are driven to crime. I don't think anyone is inherently "bad." Too optimistic? :D

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## FullCircle

> I know you're being sarcastic, but I wonder if a lot of criminals aren't merely neglected mentally ill persons. 
> 
> Frankly, I AM sorry that people are driven to crime. I don't think anyone is inherently "bad." Too optimistic? :D


Or they just got screwed by false testimony, bad cops, crappy lawyers.

I've known enough that have gotten caught in that trap to know that a jury of your peers might not be such a great thing

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## chip anderson

Full:  
But you're in Chicago, no wonder.  Don't dead people vote in the democrat collum there.?

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## FullCircle

> Full: 
> But you're in Chicago, no wonder. Don't dead people vote in the democrat collum there.?


Please. That's old.  And I'm not dead.  And not everyone I know got screwed over here.  And I;m not sure what Chicago and voting as a democrat has to do with prisoners and the legal system

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## NgCognito

I will not feel bad nor regret my statement.  I grew up inner city and I made my life without breaking laws.  I lived on minimum wage.  If these people want to get an education there is a way to get it and not always with money.  I am also a victim of sexual assault and this person had an education as well.  So don't tell me that these poor people don't have a choice but to commit crime.  Also, I am in a family of law enforcement, corrections officers, and military personel.  I hear all kinds of stories of repeat offenders and people who just did not listen to common sense when they commited their crime.  

Now, don't get me completely wrong, some people do get 'railroaded' by the system.  I do believe that as well.  But, when hundred's of millions of people in the US alone can abide by the rules, why can't these people?

:angry:

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## chip anderson

Voting Democrat has a lot to do with criminals in the legal system.  Most enjoying the hospitality of the state or Federal Government are democrats.  Why do you think the dems and the ACLU want voting rights for the incarcerated?

Chip

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## gemstone

I served on a county grand jury not too long ago.  The first Monday in every month for a year.  I can tell you that even in rural NC it's almost ALL drug related.  I believe the government should give away crack and meth, all they want.  That would stop most crime.

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## chip anderson

Gemstone:
Yeah, especially if given away in single lethal strengths.

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## Websta

> It's all fun and games until one of you is in the wrong place at the wrong time and thrown in one of their jails through a miscarriage of justice.


I would say that if you found yourself in this situation then you most likely belong there. The majority of law-abiding citizens dont/wouldn't find themselves in places like this.

There is always going to be choice in any situation and if you choose to take the wrong path, then you gotta face whatevers down that road.

I do feel for those who may have had a bad deal. But how many stories do you hear of people being sentenced incorrectly? a couple a year? How many people in prisons? 
It is always going to be a bit contentious, and the victim groups and civil rights groups will always clash. I would rather err on the side of victims though. When it happened with my wife, it was the scariest thing on earth and I for one dont want these types of people out there.

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## Optician Magician

I don't think that petty criminals or white collar criminals should be lumped into the "tent city" type of prison.  The punishment should fit the crime.  Murderers, sex offenders, and people who have physically hurt or had intentions of hurting/killing others... should face harsher sentences and have to do "hard time".  No amenities, just 4 bare walls, a bed, and a toilet.  Exercise restricted to walking the yard 30min/week.  Books (educational or religious only) would be allowed.  No personal contact with the outside, only letters.  Inmates shouldn't be allowed to have physical contact with each other.  Each would remain in his/her cell except for weekly walks.  Aren't you glad I'm not in charge! :)

Also the sentencing of 234 years is just stupid.  Why bother, just say the rest of your life.  I personally am all for the death penalty when it involves a cold blooded murder with at least 2 credible witnesses.  And I don't think that chemical castration is enough for repeat sex offenders, I would prefer the real thing.  But that is just me.  :)

As for petty crimes (drugs, theft, white collar, involuntary manslaughter etc.)  Drop the long sentencing for first timers, and put them in a prison without all the amenities for a week or two.  Make a really big first impression on them and chances are they won't be repeat offenders.  If they do repeat, then up the time spent.  But in a prison with basic/plus amenities... such as contact with other prisoners, daily exercise, TV during dinner, and education/work program.  Make the time spent useful.  Also all drug/alcohol offenders should be forced to go through a rehab program.

I know this makes me sound like a heartless witch, but there are WAY to many people clogging up our jails that shouldn't be there and we are letting Way too many serious offenders out early (that go back to killing, rape, and gangs) to make room.

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## Fezz

Has anybody responding so far ever been in prison? Every visited prison? Have you ever smelled a prison?


I have.........and believe me, I am more than sure that I don't ever want to visit, stay, drive by, look at, or think about ever again!


 :cry: :cheers::cheers::cheers:;)

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## kidsparrow

gemstone, you sigged my being offended? Are you proud that you offended me?  :Confused:

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## Jacqui

> Has anybody responding so far ever been in prison? Every visited prison? Have you ever smelled a prison?
> 
> 
> I have.........and believe me, I am more than sure that I don't ever want to visit, stay, drive by, look at, or think about ever again!
> 
> 
> :cheers::cheers::cheers:;)


Used to drive by one twice a day, almost 4 years of it.

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## chip anderson

Been inside Goree and Huntsville, didn't seem like anywhere I wanted to spend any time , but didn't see anything unsanitary or inhumaine.  Didn't seem like a resort but then didn't compare to what I have heard Parchman is like.

Chip

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## Websta

> Has anybody responding so far ever been in prison? Every visited prison? Have you ever smelled a prison?
> 
> 
> I have.........and believe me, I am more than sure that I don't ever want to visit, stay, drive by, look at, or think about ever again!
> 
> 
> :cheers::cheers::cheers:;)


Your reputation precedes you Fezz. I am quite surprised you remember what the place smelt like............:cheers: or do you only remember how it looked through beer-bottle bottom glasses!:cheers:
Sorry, i know this is a serious matter. I have been in a military prison which is almost as bad. And friends that have spent a night in the real deal (after too many stale ales!!) have said that it was terrifying.......strange though, that they still hit the grog quite hard? What will it take?

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## Optician Magician

I've had two step brothers and a step father go to prison.  Sadly it didn't make an impact.

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## NgCognito

I have an ex-husband, aunt, uncle that have all worked in corrections.  I hear the stories they tell about how the inmates complain because they got roasted chicken instead of fried or not enough fabric softener or not enough hot water.  They complain because they didn't get to watch one tv show over another because the others inmates.  It's sometimes better for them inside the prison then out.  They get three square meals, tv, heat or ac, bed, clothes, exercise and a roof over their heads.  And, they generally still conduct gang business within.  One story I heard is a former inmate was arrested 30 minutes after his release because he tried to steal a car because he wanted a ride home.

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## Johns

Just being in Air Force basic training, was as close as prison as I've ever come.  We were treated fairly, fed really well, and had many comforts.  

The part that felt like prison was not having the basic freedoms to speak, eat, use the bathroom, stand up, or sit down when I wanted to.  

Like I said, basic training was a piece of cake, but I don't ever want to experience anything close to prison.

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## HarryChiling

> Has anybody responding so far ever been in prison? Every visited prison? Have you ever smelled a prison?
> 
> 
> I have.........and believe me, I am more than sure that I don't ever want to visit, stay, drive by, look at, or think about ever again!
> 
> 
> :cheers::cheers::cheers:;)


Did some time in local, as a juvie did a butt load of time in a bunch of juvie places, it's pretty easy if you do it right walk in just punch the first person you see in the face (that way you avoid haveing to unpack and repack) spend your time in solitary where you can read all the books you want and scribble on all the walls you want.

You hink the adult places stink try the juvies or hopper units, the kids get in their mind a concept of what jail is supposed to be like from all the TV they watch and they try to make that crap for real,  got stabed in the back twice in juvie and watched one kid get sexually assaulted, when your 5'8" 14yo you keep your mouth shut or become the next victim.

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